The Complex Perplexities of George and Shellie Zimmerman
Tuesday, June 12, 2012 at 8:39PM Today was a very busy day, that’s for sure. I’m collecting my thoughts for an article related to the days events. I took a number of pictures at the task force forum I attended earlier, but the judge’s written order explaining why he revoked George’s bond must take precedence. It was quite direct. There’s also the issue of Shellie Zimmerman’s arrest on a nasty little perjury charge. Do I think they were planned together? No, absolutely not. Coincidence? That is more likely the case. The judge’s order was pending and so was the arrest warrant. One is through the court and the other is through the state. That’s two separate branches of the government and they don’t send love letters back and forth. Everything must diligently and properly go through the legal system. Period.
For now, it’s clear to see the judge and attorney’s office mean business. While some may look lightly on these offenses, the people in charge — the REAL ones — are not playing games. This is some serious stuff.
While I had set my sights on another topic, this is very important to address, so expect it to be my next post. Was the judge too critical in his ruling? Was Shellie’s arrest a bargaining chip for the state? That’s what I’ll be focusing on.
I will say this about the day. I had an opportunity to shake Tracy Martin’s hand and offer my condolences. He was very gracious. From everything I’ve witnessed so far, Trayvon’s parents are regular people, just like you and me. No different. Sybrina Fulton said she is not against guns. Her father is a retired Miami cop. She wants the law changed. Tracy Martin said he will be spending Father’s Day, this Sunday, at the cemetery — with Trayvon. Remember to keep those things in your mind as you consider this case.
Dave Knechel | in Angela Corey, Benjamin Crump, Bernie De la Rionda, Dave Knechel, David B. Knechel, David Knechel, George Zimmerman, Judge Kenneth R. Lester, Jr., Marinade Dave, Marinade Dave Knechel, Mark O'Mara, Seminole County Courthouse, Seminole County Jail, Slimm v. Zimm, Stand Your Ground, State Attorney Angela Corey, State Attorney's Office, Sybrina Fulton, Tracy Martin, Trayvon Martin, Zimm v. Slimm, marinadedave | Share Article | 2 References 
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Reader Comments (148)
I am sure that the one managing the Fund will take into account the total of the monies rec'd via donations. This would include monies spent by the Z's prior to the balance being transferred to O'Mara.
This is something Baez neglected to do when Casey was paid the $200K from ABC.
Laurali, That information on O'Mara's website is at odds with information on the IRS website. I also found a Forbes article that deals with the Zimmermans' specific situation:
"With a cash gift, there is no federal income tax consequence to the recipient. Cash gifts include checks and payments received through third party processors like PayPal. So the Zimmermans won’t have to report that cash to the IRS come next April."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphillipserb/2012/06/12/the-zimmerman-defense-fund-donations-and-taxes-sorting-it-all-out/
I believe that O'Mara is mistaken.
http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/87267817
At the above link they have GZ's application with the Sheriff's Department. It gives an area to explain arrest, I find it interesting that GZ says the undercover assaulted him first. Seems like he is always the victim of the situation he is in.
I am going to take a few days off or maybe a long time from commenting anymore. When I commented about finances I thought we were talking about the Zimmerman's. I have point blank asked questions of people who would usually reply and I received nothing in return. So it is obvious to me that some people only care about their very own opinions and not others.
Total amount paid off a little over ten thousand. Seems like a couple working full time could manage that, even if one only worked part time. JMO No need to ask me to stay after today I am just done.
I found the following....
"[You] should put a reminder on your phone, to call him [Ken, who runs the PayPal] and make sure that he does it every day, and that you transfer from mine to yours every day," Zimmerman tells his wife Shellie.
Read more: http://www.wesh.com/news/central-florida/trayvon-martin-extended-coverage/New-evidence-released-in-Zimmerman-case/-/14266478/15142862/-/8sk6he/-/index.html#ixzz1yC97QaBJ
During the sixth telephone call, Z asked Shellie if she heard from O'Mara and she said, "no, but Ken did."
What does this mean? Was O'Mara aware of what the Z's were doing???
Dave, I hope you feel better and can listen to that call....
Laurali, I responded to your post about the income tax issue quite a while ago, and got a message that my post had been submitted and would appear soon, but it still hasn't. I will see if this one works and, if so, I'll reproduce the one that seems to have been lost (or maybe it will pop up at some point?)
Well, that worked, so I'll try posting the information I found again.
Laurali, I believe that the information from O'Mara's site is incorrect. According to the IRS website, donations (gifts) are not taxable to the recipient. I also found an article in Forbes that is specific to the Zimmermans' situation:
"With a cash gift, there is no federal income tax consequence to the recipient. Cash gifts include checks and payments received through third party processors like PayPal. So the Zimmermans won’t have to report that cash to the IRS come next April."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphillipserb/2012/06/12/the-zimmerman-defense-fund-donations-and-taxes-sorting-it-all-out/
Just posted again, but it seems to have been lost again???
Two test posts have worked, the real post has been lost twice! Here goes again:
Laurali, I believe that the information on O'Mara's site about the Zimmermans having to pay income tax on the donations is incorrect. First, the IRS website is clear that donations (gifts) are not taxable to the recipient. Second, I found a Forbes article on this topic, specific to the Zimmermans:
"With a cash gift, there is no federal income tax consequence to the recipient. Cash gifts include checks and payments received through third party processors like PayPal. So the Zimmermans won’t have to report that cash to the IRS come next April."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphillipserb/2012/06/12/the-zimmerman-defense-fund-donations-and-taxes-sorting-it-all-out/
This will probably be lost....
Posted it a third time, and it was lost again. I don't know whether posts with links are being lost?
I'll try it in two parts:
Laurali, I believe that the information on O'Mara's site about the Zimmermans having to pay income tax on the donations is incorrect. First, the IRS website is clear that donations (gifts) are not taxable to the recipient. Second, I found a Forbes article on this topic, specific to the Zimmermans:
Will continue in next post...
First half worked, this is the second part...
The following paragraph is from the Forbes article:
"With a cash gift, there is no federal income tax consequence to the recipient. Cash gifts include checks and payments received through third party processors like PayPal. So the Zimmermans won’t have to report that cash to the IRS come next April."
Finally, I got the post to work by splitting it in two. Here is the link to the Forbes article:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphillipserb/2012/06/12/the-zimmerman-defense-fund-donations-and-taxes-sorting-it-all-out/
I tried to post the link to the Forbes article, and it didn't appear. You can find the article by googling "Forbes" and "Zimmerman."
Snoopy, I listened to two conversations and I agree that George seems to be in charge, giving Shellie very explicit instructions. I also don't believe that he has ADD, after listening to him manage all this, including hints to put reminders on the phone. I almost feel sorry for her. She seems to be very much in love with him, and she is trying hard to keep his spirits up. But it is jarring to hear her tell him how great their lives are going to be. I hope that she did not really mean that their lives are going to be great now that he is raking in money as a result of having killed an innocent boy! Neither of them seem at all concerned about Trayvon and his family.
MollyK~~what a sin! I know how frustrating it is when the comments wont show. I always type mine out in notepad and then copy and paste. I have to click on 'log in' prior to every comment even if I post them just minutes apart..
I just deleted a duplicate of the comment I made... this place has gremlins running wild...
MollieK~ ~ there are around 150 more jail calls but I doubt if we will get to hear any of them. It seems Shellie was trying to keep Z's spirits up by saying encouraging things. Love can be blind. Z was cool, calm and collected. I know a lot of people who have ADD and they are tranquil when on their medication.
MollieK~ ~ I will try and make your link clickable....
Mollie's link-re donations and taxes due
Now it seems that my missing comments have all popped up, in places where I swear they did not exist before! Snoopy, can you delete extra comments? Where do I click on login? I don't see that on my screen.
Gremlins, indeed!
MollieK~~I log in...top left of this page under Navigation... I cannot delete in here or go inside the comments like I can at my own blog... Dave is under the weather.. I wouldn't worry about the duplicates. I just read at the Forbes site... it seems I learn something new every day... I copied the following while I was there...
What a lot of folks don’t realize is that the federal gift tax is payable by the person making the transfer or the gift, not the recipient. So, the Zimmermans will not have any gift tax consequences as a result of the defense fund; donors would, however, if they made gifts in excess of $13,000 (so far that hasn’t happened).
I think the tax laws regarding gifts from family members are quite clear, however, the money received from a PayPal donate button from non family members might be considered income. Definitely something I would ask for an IRS ruling on before I failed to report any income received that way. I think one might be on fairly shaky ground there, even though those donations were not made for any services rendered or with the expectation of anything in return.
Vicky, it doesn't matter whether a gift comes from a family member or a stranger. I am still baffled about why the Zimmermans were so intent on keeping transactions below $10k.
Thanks for making the link clickable, Snoopy. You're right that love is blind. Initially, I wondered whether George's wife might be so horrified by his actions that she would leave him. I can't imagine being married to a man who was capable of what GZ did that night. But she seems to be devoted to him.
I'm bothered by George's remark to the effect that "Americans" are supporting him, as if his case is some sort of patriotic cause.
Molly, does this help?
The Bank Secrecy Act of 1970 (or BSA, or otherwise known as the Currency and Foreign Transactions Reporting Act) requires financial institutions in the United States to assist U.S. government agencies to detect and prevent money laundering. Specifically, the act requires financial institutions to keep records of cash purchases of negotiable instruments, and file reports of cash purchases of these negotiable instruments of more than $10,000 (daily aggregate amount), and to report suspicious activity that might signify money laundering, tax evasion, or other criminal activities. Many banks will no longer sell negotiable instruments when they are purchased with cash, requiring the purchase to be withdrawn from an account at that institution.
Source
and here's more info in pdf
Reporting Cash Transactions over $10,000
Thank you, Snoopy! This does make it clear that only cash transactions are affected. So my question remains: why were the Zimmermans concerned about bank transfers?
Laura please don't go. Your posts have been a great contribution here. I know, Snoopy knows and Porky and Molly know as do others that you were talking about GZ's character and no one else. We knew what you meant when using that one aspect of his life as the example for your reasoning.
GZ and later his wife, seperately racked up credit card bills a few years apart, then didn't pay. We all know there was no disability and we know they both had jobs at some point during some of that spending. Why wouldn't they pay? Is does leave the impression of "buy now, and never pay later"....
Snoop - you're doing a fantastic job. And you are staying neutral as much as one can in this case. Have you found out if he ever went to the doc to get clearance for work? Or did he just quit his job?
Has anyone else noticed that GZ lied about the extra passport he had? I'm sure the judge is p.o. about that.
I have only listened to partial calls. with all the "code" bandied about and the low whispers of GZ its clear they were trying to hide something. I'm not buying his lawyers excuse about them mistrusting the law.....
burning questions. lol.
I have an interesting observation about the donation thing. Many people loudly complained about Al Sharpton coming to Sanford but bets are many of those same people will fund Zimmerman to the tune of hundreds of thousands of dollars. Call it what you want.
I agree, Porky, and I'm thinking the h-word.
For some reason, I'm wondering exactly what GZ had in mind when he called the special prosecutor. Did he think he was going to talk her out of prosecuting him? I can't remember ever hearing of a defendant doing something like this.
I'm also wondering whether G&S were considering leaving the country. In one of the conversations, they discuss a passport in a bag that "Ken" has, and another passport in a safety deposit box. It isn't clear whether the second passport is Shellie's or the second GZ passport (that was, according to O'M, only found later when they were moving). The discussion of moving it to another safety deposit box in SZ's name only needs some explanation.
Mollie~ ~I cannot figure out why Shellie used the figure of $9999 when she made the transfers from the paypal to her own account. When they withdrew it out of her account, where did she put it in a safety deposit box or set up another account? I only saw the one bank statement. I noticed that she made more than one transfer in the same day using that $9999 and one time I think it was $9950. If the Bank Securiy Act did apply to her, all those daily transactions add up to more than the $10,000 threshold (daily limit) so I am at the loss what S and Z were doing.
I did a bit of research last night but it would be much easier if I were dealing with our Canadian laws which I am familar with.
We have Mark O'Mara saying the donations are taxable and then we have Forbes saying they are gifts and not taxable. The donations were not for services rendered so are considered unearned income. I found different interpretations of what is considered taxable when it comes to earned or unearned income.
I see where Laura found her information but it conflcts with what Forbes says. Not all attorneys are familar with IRS rules and regulations so have their own chartered accountants.
Since all the transfers from the paypal to Shellie's bank account and then transferred to God what where were not withdrawn to make purchases, I agree with you that they would not fall under this Bank Security Act.
Well, this will end me trying to figure out these monies.... it is too difficult dealing with some of your US IRS rules and regulations...
Mystical~ ~ I don't like to see anyone get so frustrated that they decide to not comment in here anymore. Laura has left before and I can chalk up dozens of times that I have thrown in the towel here but always end up returning to the scene of the crime.
If I left every time someone disagreed with me ( I have lost count re this Zimmerman case) I would be long gone forever. I do my best to hang in here if only to keep Porky entertained. lol
We are all adults and have our own personal lives in the real world to deal with. Many times we incorporate in our comments what we have or experienced in our own lives. In other words, we may deal with this Zimmerman case and his financial woes in the same way that we would take care of our own keeping in mind that we do not all think alike. A good rule of thumb is not to force what you feel is the right way on your fellow commenters.
I am going to quote something Laura said in her supposedly last comment...I have point blank asked questions of people who would usually reply and I received nothing in return. So it is obvious to me that some people only care about their very own opinions and not others.
I find that remark uncalled for as patience is a virtue. I did notice that I was asked a question and at the time was listening to phone calls and trying to post links in here. Mollie was trying to comment back to Laura but having difficulty with her comments showing up. The gremlins finally released many duplicate comments made by Mollie which proves she really tried.
If I find that someone is quite capable of looking up (googling) their own information, I will give them a chance to do that rather than cater to them. This is something that I have learned over the past few years when constant demands were being made on me. 'God helps those who help themselves"... my Mom's favorite saying.
I hope Dave will take the time to come in here and if he doesn't show up soon, I will have to page James McIntyre and have him make his presense know and straighten us all out...
Surely you jest Snoop.!
Estee~~there is method in my madness. lol
What do you think?
George Zimmerman: Will he get bond?
I am wondering whether the judge will re-open the passport issue.
To MollyK
Thanks MK,
I sure would like to know what's going on behind the scenes... From the jailhouse calls, they seem to think things will work out..are they naive, or amoral? Are they faking it..doesn't seem they grasp the magnitude of what they're facing.
MollyK~~Judge Lester just seemed to shush it off at the bond hearing. Judges seem to like to deal with one issue at a time and it seemed the Z's financial standing was the focus. If Lester does some homework and realizes that the Z's were trying to hang on to or hide the passport that expires in 2014, he may think twice about letting Z bond out. Since O'Mara has control of the funds, Z would never have the finances to get too far if they planned on leaving the country. The GPS devices have been known to be cut off so they are not a 100% security.
On the other hand, if Judge Lester does not let Z bond out, which I believe he is entitled to if he can raise the money, the good judge may be asked to recuse himself due to bias against Z.
Now as a last resort, someone may be able to convince Dave to run up to the bench and give Kenneth Lester a big hug and then he will have to step down.
Only in Florida!
mhaven, I only had time to listen to 3 of the calls so far, but it was striking how positive they both seemed, almost excited about the future. It was strange. Perhaps Shellie was trying hard to keep George's spirits up? I really, really wonder whether they were planning to leave the country. They were talking about two passports, where they were located and where to keep them. If the two passports were both G's, then they knew that he had both passports back then. This is inconsistent with their story that one passport was found when they were moving after GZ was bailed out of jail. If the second passport was Shellie, then it seems that they were considering leaving the country. Why else the concern about where her passport was? They may have known that GZ would have to turn his in, but this does not apply to Shellie's.
Snoopy, I believe that the judge accepted O'Mara's explanation that he had forgotten to submit the second passport after obtaining it from GZ. I am sure that O'Mara was telling the truth. But it appears that now there is a question about the passports from an earlier time, before GZ turned his second passport over to O'Mara. Maybe there is an explanation for it, but it strikes me as suspicious. If the Zs were doing something shaky, I'm sure O'Mara had no idea.
"If the second passport was Shellie's..."
"shaky" should be "shady"
I just want to stop in and say I haven't died yet, but I am not feeling well at all. I'm not looking for any get well wishes or anything, I just want to go back to writing. I've got some juicy stuff on my plate and one actually discusses whether Judge Lester would have to step down. I have the answer. I also want to address the phone calls and, specifically, what the Zimmermans were thinking. Were they really broke before the windfall?
Tomorrow, I hope. Thank you for being patient.
I hope you feel better soon, Dave! We'll look forward to your next post when you are ready to write it.
Dave, you must, I say must, get your post(s) written soon ! Your statements are somewhat of a tease at this point.....lol .
Snoopy, you crack me up. " Dave to run up to the bench and give Kenneth Lester a big hug and then he will have to step down."
My opinion on GZ and his wife: I think GZ is delusional and his wife is living in the same world. I read that GZ and his wife knocked on doors in that complex giving their card to the resident. It said they suggested the resident put it on their roll-a-dex or on their icebox in case they needed to contact them. This is past common sense in your duties as a Neighborhood Watchman. GZ and his "gun toting" would appear to live in the world of needing to be "tough" and brag about how it can be done....you know....his choice of college courses, need to be on the police staff, need to "rescue" the apartment complex from all the bad people and making himself known to those associated with law enforcement etc etc. I believe he had gone over and over in his mind what he would do if a situation such as the TM would occur. He had gone over and over in his mind what to do if he shot someone. I am sure he had conversations with his wife and others about how dangerous the world is and he never went without his gun. I believe he is extremely immature and delusional. It is a world some of these carry/conceal "cowboys" live in. He is John Wayne !!!!
It all reminds me of those who could see the world crashing in 2000 because of the roll-over- on the computers. I knew a very smart man who spent 1999 preparing for "what was going to happen". He built a bunker which was not only stocked with water, food and other necessities but was stocked to the hilt with guns and ammo. He would need to protect his abode. Good Lord, that was his world....he would survive. Guns, ammo and shooting people to protect him and his family.
I have to add, in a way my heart hurts for GZ and his wife. When they find reality it is going to be tough .....that is IF they find reality.
Newbie- I was thinking more like James Bond, or Jason Bourne (except he was smart), listening to the portions of tape being aired on the radio. I was driving and I kept looking down at the console saying "WHAT???!!!" Peter Pan indeed! The fact that they both thought they could get away with this IN FLORIDA (Sunshine Law, Dude?) shows that they are dim, dim bulbs. The fact he was speaking so, so softly, hardly audible, shows he KNEW it was shady. The John Wayne part was how he felt at the "event" itself!
Oh, and Dave, I hope you feel better pronto, and not just for the selfish reason that I want to read what you got!
Random thoughts:
Why did G and S have guns? The story they offer is that there is a vicious pit bull in their neighborhood, they have been threatened by it, and a police officer recommended guns as protection. But no one else seems to be worried about the pit bull. Children play in the sidewalk/grassy area between the townhouses. Trayvon used to play football with the neighborhood kids there when he visited. Children walk dogs there - remember the boy who saw the fight but had to run after his dog, who had escaped? G justifies his high level of suspicion and his focus on the neighborhood watch by saying that there had been burglaries. G supporters describe the gated community as a "high-crime" neighborhood. But I think I read somewhere that there had not been a burglary for months. Brandy Green said that she hadn't heard anything about a crime problem. Several residents who were interviewed said that they had moved to the neighborhood for their childrens' sake. The physical set-up of the community was good for children. They can walk around on sidewalks that are not near the street. There is a sheltered area between the townhouses to play with other children. It is easy and safe to walk to a friend's house. There is a pool. The community is racially mixed with lots of children. It had become much more affordable when real estate values crashed; many of the units were being rented. Before Trayvon's murder, they had considered the community safe. Why was G so preoccupied with crime and safety?
I hope this is working now.
The issue of why Shellie Zimmerman would only transfer 9999 at a time might just go back to that particular bank's policies. They might have a 10,000 limit on transactions. It could be that she can't make more than 10,000 in any one withdrawl/transfer transaction and no more than 20,000 in any one day. I haven't been to that bank''s website so I don't know for sure. It's just speculation on my part. Each bank has their own ATM limits, so I would imagine they each have their own maximum amts that can be manipulated in one day.
Tracy Martin's call to PD-Audio
Dispatch calls Tracy back-Audio
Channel 13 is reporting that the Sanford Police Chief has just been fired.http://www.baynews9.com/content/news/baynews9/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2012/6/20/sanford_police_chief.html
Lots of new information on O'Mara's website - GZ's interviews with police, a video of the walkthrough, etc. I have to get to work and won't have time to read or view anything until tonight.
http://gzlegalcase.com/
With Zimmerman currently in jail being Bubba's new boy toy of coures, in the moment of panic, you will say almost anything to gain the sypathy of Prosectution, the Judge, and possibly public supporters. In a recent CNN headline Zimmerman alleges that Martin jumped out of the bushes. I know this issue has been discussed but I wonder if he ever stops and thinks about the absurdity of the notion that Martin was first hiding....from him...the persuer?
As for those supporting Zimmerman I too understand what they are doing, well at least from my point of view. I would doubt that all his supported condone murder but agree that a person has a right to stand his ground...truth be told that IF Martin truly jumped from the bushes wasnt he standing his ground too?
The problem, as we progress to a trial, is that it simply turned from a "self defense" scenario to a senseless murder...that has progressed to a possible racial bias.
This isnt about concealed firearms its about using the firearm beyond "self defense" all the while claiming "self defense"...its not difficult to asscertain (see what i did there ☺) the type of person Zimmerman is but self reflection is a lot different then public view....JMO
I'm working on the video and the call to the SPD dispatcher. This is what I will be writing about now. I'm finding some issues...